9. Entrepreneurship, Fulfillment and Purpose with Alyssa Kerbel
EPISODE 9
Alyssa Kerbel, the founder of mini mioche, built her business on sustainable, ethical practices and when the time was right, exited mini mioche in order to continue making the impact she craved.
Success isn't one-size-fits-all and Alyssa and Julie discuss how redefining success to align with personal values can lead to fulfilling work that goes beyond profits.
Catch the Conversation
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Alyssa Kerbel is a multi-passionate, heart-led, impact-driven entrepreneur who, over the past 20+ years, has started, grown, sold and exited two companies (Alyssa Agency, a wholesale fashion agency and mini mioche, a children’s apparel and lifestyle brand).
Alyssa founded mini mioche in 2008 as a passion project and ‘side hustle’ after the birth of her first child to fill a void in the children’s apparel market for simple, gender-neutral organic cotton basics. mini mioche went on to become a multi-million dollar direct-to-consumer brand, while paving the way in sustainable and ethical fashion and values-based business practices.
In 2023, Alyssa sold mini mioche in order to focus on her passions in the areas of community building, wellness and supporting female entrepreneurship.
You can connect with Alyssa at her website or on Instagram, Facebook, or LinkedIn. -
**From fashion sales to founding mini mioche (00:01:18)**
Alyssa shares the story of founding mini mioche as a side hustle and her transition from working in fashion sales to launching her own sustainable and ethical fashion brand for children, while still running her agency.
**Transition and Tough Decisions (00:09:35)**
Alyssa discusses the pivotal moment when she realized the need to let go of her agency business and the tough decisions involved in transitioning her focus to mini mioche.
**Advocacy and Charity Work (00:19:22)**
The conversation shifts to Alyssa's integration of advocacy and charity work into mini mioche's business ethos, emphasizing the importance of giving back..
**Adapting to the pandemic (00:21:13)**
The impact of the pandemic on mini mioche's business, transitioning to e-commerce, and the positive effects on sales.
**Realigning with personal values by exiting (00:22:22)**
Alyssa's realization of losing joy and fulfillment in her business as it became more transactional and less meaningful. They discuss the importance of goals, impact, and aligning her business with her personal values, as well as the challenge of exiting a business.
**Creating community spaces and supporting female founders (00:37:04)**
Alyssa's vision for using the acquired space to build community, foster human connection, and support wellness practices.
**The importance of holistic goals, defining success, and finding community (00:42:02)**
Alyssa and Julie discuss the significance of holistic goals for personal and business success, and consistently re-evaluating goals in service of personal and business needs.
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Julie Ellis (00:00:04) - Welcome to Figure Eight, where we feature inspiring stories of women entrepreneurs who have grown their businesses to seven and eight figures revenue. If you are in the mix of growing a bigger business, these stories are for you. Join us as we explore where the tough spots are, how to overcome them, and how to prepare yourself for the next portion of the climb. I'm your host, Julie Ellis. I'm an author, entrepreneur, and a growth in leadership coach who co-founded, grew, and exited an eight figure business. This led me to exploring why some women achieve great things, and that led to my book, Big Gorgeous Goals. Let's explore the systems, processes and people that help us grow our businesses to new heights. If you're interested in growing your business, this podcast will help. Now let's get going. Welcome to this episode of Figure Eight. Today I'm welcoming Alyssa Kerbel. She is a multi passionate, heart led, impact driven entrepreneur who over the past 20 plus years has started, grown and exited two companies.
Julie Ellis (00:01:18) - Most recently, she founded mini mioche in 2008 as a passion project and a side hustle after the birth of her first child. She built a really amazing direct to consumer brand and she paved the way in sustainability, ethical fashion and values based business, and last year she had a big transition when she sold mini mioche in order to focus on her passions in the area of community building, wellness and supporting female entrepreneurship. So welcome, Alyssa. It's so great to see you today.
Alyssa Kerbel (00:01:50) - It's an honor to be here. I'm super excited to have this conversation with you, Julie.
Julie Ellis (00:01:57) - Thank you. Well, what can you tell me? We've known each other for a good few years now., but what can you tell all of our listeners about mini mioche, how you started and what you built it into?
Alyssa Kerbel (00:02:10) - So I started mini mioche. I've kind of been a serial entrepreneur. I think ultimately it's interesting. I never as a young person thought about entrepreneurship as a career. I don't think back in the day it was really encouraged or thought of when when, you know, our demographic was young, it was like, you're going to work for someone else.
Alyssa Kerbel (00:02:31) - Like, that's what you do and for the rest of your life. Yeah. Like that's that's what we do. We just get a job and we work for somebody. And so it was never on my radar to be an entrepreneur. However, I ended up landing. My first career was really in sales. It was in fashion sales. And I really found after bouncing around and being lost in my 20s for quite some time, I finally found kind of my groove in sales, which also, interestingly, is not a career that is necessarily thought of or encouraged when we're young. Like people don't necessarily go, oh, I'm going to become a sales person, but I love sales. I actually love selling, I love marketing, I love relationship building, I love talking to people. I love, selling something that I'm passionate about or that I think can improve someone's life or that's actually a really good product or service or whatever. I don't find that icky, which a lot of people do. I find it fun.
Alyssa Kerbel (00:03:27) - And so I found my groove in fashion sales. I left after a period of time, started my own wholesale fashion agency in my 20s, so that was my foray into entrepreneurship. I ran that business for about five years, and then I really planned it out, as a lot of, I think female entrepreneurs do. I was like, okay, now I'm going to have a baby. Now this is like, you don't really get a mat leave. You don't get time off unless, you know, some people do. If they've really built out an infrastructure to support them while they're away. Amazing. I think more women are able to do that now and are thinking that way. Back in those days with my daughter's 16 now, I wasn't thinking that way. It was like, I will set it up so I can take a little bit of time off, but I really have to be there and I have to go back. So I had my daughter and, this was 16 years ago, and after I had her, I had every intention to go back to my business, my agency business, which was selling adult clothing brands to stores and retailers across Ontario.
Alyssa Kerbel (00:04:30) - But I think I had a couple things were just. Calling, not sitting like. And it's crazy because I had just had a baby, but there was a part of me that felt a little bored, you know, and the idea of going back and running my agency business, I'd been in it five years at that point and just selling other people's brands and doing the same thing. And, you know, the collections come in and I sell them, and then they ship. It's like it was a little like, I don't know, repetitive. And it didn't feel like I had a lot of control over it. And I think I just had this innate desire to have more creativity in my work and to feel like I was building something that was more my own, even though I was already building something that was my own. It didn't feel quite the same because I was accountable to my suppliers. I was accountable to, you know, like, you know, these quotas, all these things and people sort of still telling me what to do and how to do it.
Alyssa Kerbel (00:05:31) - I was like, I just want to do my own thing. I just want to figure this out and at the time, you know, my, my, my daughter was a newborn and I have always loved like really great basics. Like, I am a basic girl. I am not a fancy girl. You know me Julie. Like I just love a good soft t shirt, sweatshirt, sweatpants. Like I'm all about comfort, I love quality, I like good style, but I am not fancy and that is just my vibe. And at the time when I was trying to find clothes for my my daughter, she, you know, I couldn't find like just soft basics, like comfy, soft basics. There was just not a lot on the market. I would go to these stores that I would personally not shop in for myself. And, and they had stuff on them and they were hard and crunchy and like, I just was like, oh, like, I don't want to put this on my little baby with newborn skin and like, so anyway, I just decided sort of in that moment without really much thought, I was like, I think there is a need for this product.
Alyssa Kerbel (00:06:37) - I want this for her. I'm going to just see if I can create my own baby clothing brand. That's all about like soft, organic cotton basics that are gender neutral, that are made sustainably, that are made in Canada. And I really tapped my existing kind of network and people and knowledge from the agency world to create this thing as just a side hustle. It was purely like, let's just get this going and see if it can go anywhere. But I did love it because it was my own baby. Like, it was like everything from the marketing to the product to picking the colours to the copy that I was sharing the messaging around the brand, how we did things. You know, why we did things the way we did them. That was all really like fun to me, to have that creative control. And and there's a, you know, I did Strategic Coach for a period of time, which I'm sure you're familiar with. It's a coaching program for entrepreneurs. That's all kind of about really setting up your life as much as possible so that your business serves you and you're not serving your business.
Alyssa Kerbel (00:07:43) - That's the idea. And there's an expression in that program that they teach. That is who, not how. That's a thing. So it's not about like people have ideas. They want to start something they like. My idea was like, okay, I want to start a baby clothing brand. Well, like I actually have no experience in manufacturing. I have no experience in design. I've never worked a day of retail actually, in my life. Like, and instead of being like, I have no idea how to do this, I was like, who do I know that that could help me? Who do I know in my industry, in my network? Who's doing something similar? Who would know someone who does manufacturing? Who does know someone who maybe knows something about fabrics? Like, I just started to, like, reach out and ask people for help that, you know, I felt might be open to helping me. And you know what? They were right. Like, I just would approach them very honestly and say, like, I have this idea.
Alyssa Kerbel (00:08:38) - I want to start this thing. I don't even have the first clue where to start. But I have a very clear vision of what it is I'm wanting to create, and I'm wondering if you can point me in the direction of this or that or whatever. And that's kind of how it got going. And I was still running my agency on the side, which not on the side, sorry. That was my main focus. That was my main job for a long, long time. Let's be clear. Like that was not this was the thing on the side. But I kept my day job. My other company, and I ran them both actually for seven years until I finally sold the agency business. I finally got to a place where mini mioche had grown and was kind of a beast in and of itself, and it became clear that like, it was time to focus and I was being pulled in too many directions and I felt like I honestly just wasn't doing anything well at that point, like I wasn't being able to devote my time.
Alyssa Kerbel (00:09:35) - And energy dominion. And so that was suffering. I wasn't able to really be present for my agency, and I was kind of checked out of that. And so that was suffering. And I was also suffering personally with trying to be a mom. And I'd had another baby. And like, I just was juggling way too many things. And I actually, like, went to landmark., I don't know if you're familiar with landmark form. I've done a lot of personal stuff, a lot of personal growth things along the way that have all been amazing. Landmark forum is another personal growth type thing, and I went there for a weekend seminar thing, and I came out of that with the clarity of like, it's I need to make a change. My this my life is not working. And so so you.
Julie Ellis (00:10:18) - Kind of knew going in, you knew going into it that things were not where you wanted them to be, but you didn't have the clarity of what to do about it.
Alyssa Kerbel (00:10:26) - Correct.
Alyssa Kerbel (00:10:27) - I didn't actually, I think at the time, I didn't actually consider letting the agency go because we get into these head spaces where it's like we feel like we can't or we're still financially dependent on it, or like, what will my suppliers think? Or what's going to happen to my employees? Like, it's like all the things around the like, you know, sometimes.
Julie Ellis (00:10:50) - I think sometimes I think we even get into a space where you're like, well, I have to do it all. Like like you. You don't have a choice. But really, of course you have a choice. But it's stepping back enough to be like, oh, wait a minute, I have a choice here, and now I need to make it.
Alyssa Kerbel (00:11:07) - Totally. And I would say that, like, I have a thing around feeling like I'm abandoning people or a relinquishing responsibility. And so that was definitely a block for me. And it's been an ongoing block because this is like probably like a deeper wound, whatever.
Alyssa Kerbel (00:11:25) - But it's just like my initial thing is I'm, I'm, I'm abandoning my responsibilities. I'm, I'm relinquishing, you know, my responsibilities. I'm not going to be there for people. People need me and, and that whole thing of like, but you know, like putting myself first, my life first and making the decision. Because the thing I've learned along my journey now is that when I don't abandon things that no longer are serving me, I am abandoning me every day. Every day. I am like abandoning myself and what I truly need to thrive by compromising that for other things or people or situations that at the end of the day like that, I made the decision to sell it. I went through the whole process. In the end, some of the people who worked for me at the agency purchased it. It's still exists. It still is called Alyssa's Agency right now. It's been a decade. Everyone was fine. The suppliers stayed on. Most of them are still with her. So it's like, I think a big learning to that experience for me and others that I've been through since is this ongoing learning of instead of going to, you know, all these what if scenarios that are negative, it's like, what if the best thing happens, right? Like, what if they take it over and it's amazing.
Alyssa Kerbel (00:12:51) - What if it's still thriving ten years later? What if all those suppliers are happier with them than they were with you? What if you get some, you know, freedom and focus to do what you're actually supposed to be doing? It's like flip the script on the what ifs from the from the like worst case to the best case, and then focus on that being the outcome.
Julie Ellis (00:13:13) - Yeah. And so when you let go of the agency and sold it to your employees, what were things like at minimum then?
Alyssa Kerbel (00:13:22) - Oh, they were, they were, we were going, quite hard at that point. So over those I had done so over that seven year period. That was an insane period of my life. So this was like in my 30s into sort of my early 40s. I'm 48 right now. So over that period of time I started many I went back to work full time. I had my daughter, I launched, I made, I had the idea for many in like the fall of 2007, and I launched the product and started shipping it in June 2008.
Alyssa Kerbel (00:13:57) - So it was like, I just like did this.
Julie Ellis (00:13:59) - After knowing nothing about the apparel industry or retail.
Alyssa Kerbel (00:14:02) - There was a lot of like there was some mistakes. There was some big hiccups along the way, but you just push through, you figure it out, you keep going. But I was not paying myself. I was running the agency., I, I, we were wholesaling in the beginning, so selling to other stores then that wasn't going like super. Well, like, I mean, it was going, but it was slow. So then we launched our website with e-commerce a long time ago. So this was sort of new direct to consumer e-comm, but it was a way for me to get in front of more people with the brand and showcase the whole brand in one place. And then within two years of launching the brand, I read the E-myth. You know, that book by Michael Gerber? I might even have it here. Anyway, I read that book and I was like, I need to open a store.
Alyssa Kerbel (00:14:45) - That's what I need to do. So then I made the decision to open a retail store. And so we did on Queen Street. That was like two years in. And then, I had another baby and my son, and then we opened another store in the Distillery District in Toronto within the within that same time period. So over that course of that sort of 5 to 7 years when I was running them both, I had two kids, I was running this business, I was running that business. I had multiple stores. It was insane. Like, I don't know, like how I didn't actually have, like multiple nervous breakdowns. I mean, I thrive, you know, me, I thrive in like a fast pace. I or at least I thought I did, you know, I did, I did at that time I was thriving in sort of the creation of it all and the momentum of it all. And I had energy because I was passionate about what I was doing. And that's one thing I realized, like when people are like, how do you do that? Or how do you do this? It's like there is a level of energy that comes from inspiration, excitement, passion.
Alyssa Kerbel (00:15:49) - Like that's a driving force for people, and that's something that I also recognize when that goes away and you're not feeling that, that's the opposite of a driving force. So when the inspiration, excitement, motivation, growth isn't there, it quite often feels like a very heavy lift. It was a heavy lift during that time, but it also was fun and inspiring. And we were doing stuff and I, you know, surrounded myself with a bit of a team that was supporting me. And so I wasn't alone in it all. And so it was manageable until it wasn't, which was when I finally went to landmark had a literal breakdown in landmark. Let's just be clear. Like, how do full like my life's not working? I miserable breakdown and then made the decision. And sometimes I think we have to hit those moments where it's like the writing is so on the wall that you cannot ignore it moments. And sometimes that comes with the health scare that comes with some sort of major. Whatever. Sometimes it has to hit that point where you're then like something has to change and what needs to change, what could change.
Alyssa Kerbel (00:16:58) - And you ask yourself that question and then whatever comes up for you that is maybe standing in the way of you making that change becomes clear that that is actually not really an obstacle, right? Like that, because it's like it just is now, like it has to happen. So now it becomes a question of how is it happening?
Julie Ellis (00:17:20) - It's like it's like when it's it's like somebody turned the light on above you and all of a sudden you're like, oh, and it all comes into focus in that moment and you're like, oh, I totally know what I need to do.
Alyssa Kerbel (00:17:33) - That's true. Yeah, that was always very I mean, that was the thing when I started, it was like I was very kind of like, okay, if I'm going to do this, what would also feel good and values in line for me and also make it a point of difference in terms of how I'm selling it, how I'm marketing. And I'm always thinking like from a sales perspective, like what am I talking about? Why would you know? Why would someone buy this as opposed to some other random thing from Old Navy or whatever? Right.
Alyssa Kerbel (00:17:56) - So it was like, I'm going to try and do it in an ethical and sustainable way. I'm going to try and do it locally. I'm going to try and make sure that it's transparent. And people know, like I can show how it's made, where it's made, that it's not made. Our original tagline was like made for kids, not by kids. And this was at a time when, like, you know, certain brands that I won't mention the name of were like having factories collapse in Bangladesh and all these things were happening that were showcasing like, yeah, it does matter. You know, it might be cheap, but it actually like, what is the cost really? You know, and because of my experience and knowledge of the fashion industry, because of the agency, I had exposure to a lot of different manufacturing processes and ways of doing things. And some people were making things locally and some people weren't, and I hadn't really thought about it so much from a values perspective at that time for my own agency in terms of the brands I worked with.
Alyssa Kerbel (00:18:56) - But as I thought about it for my own, it became clear that like, I wanted to do something in an intentional way that did feel aligned with what I care about.
Julie Ellis (00:19:08) - Yeah. And then I think that kind of carries you into some of the sort of like advocacy and charity work that you started to weave into the business over the course of time as well.
Alyssa Kerbel (00:19:22) - Yeah, I think we were I feel like from pretty early on, once we had a little bit of money, once we were like, not like hemorrhaging money anymore, it always felt very like it just felt good to give back, right? Like it felt like it was part of the brand ethos too. The better we do, the the more good we can do legitimately. And I think the way we did that was always in partnership with organizations that aligned again to my personal values or something that was specific going on in the world that was in support of families, children, young people. And that also obviously, now, you see, almost every brand has some sort of give back like that is almost like you kind of just have to do that, which is great.
Alyssa Kerbel (00:20:17) - But I think that the, the challenge for a lot of brands now is that it's not just marketing and it's not just a transactional thing that it's actually like, you know, there's something behind it more because now it's kind of like, oh, we're doing this, we're doing that, we're planting a tree, or we're doing this and it's like, it's great, but it feels sort of like that's the reason you're doing it, is to try and get people to buy from you in a way. You know what I mean?
Julie Ellis (00:20:45) - Like, yeah. And I think there's a good amount of consumer skepticism, skepticism about the alt like how altruistic is it, what these brands are trying to do.
Alyssa Kerbel (00:20:55) - And I think, like, you know, for me, as the as things went on in, the business progressed and it grew bigger and I was dealing with a lot of other things. You know, the giveback component always was at the forefront, but it also everything started to kind of feel very transactional for me.
Alyssa Kerbel (00:21:13) - And that was, that was layered to, to like other things that were going on in the business and then the pandemic. So when the pandemic hit and Covid hit, you know, we were fortunate that like, the business was,. You know, a good chunk of our business at the time, more than 50% of it was already e-comm, was already online. So we had to shut the retail stores down and we had to just be online. And that was okay because.
Julie Ellis (00:21:41) - You could make a fairly seamless transition. It wasn't like you were trying to build an e-commerce site and start shipping stuff out. No.
Alyssa Kerbel (00:21:48) - And, you know, people were at home. They were lounging around with their kids there. They weren't like it was actually good business wise, profitability profitability wise and sales wise and revenue wise. It actually was a very good time for the business. And in a way, it was a good time for me because it allowed me to have a little bit of a step back from the business because it was in some ways easier to manage one thing, as opposed to e-comm and multiple stores where you're dealing with like logistics and inventory and what's selling is like it was a different beast with the retail stores.
Alyssa Kerbel (00:22:22) - , and so there was a part of me that loved just having one thing and just focusing on one thing and building that one thing out more. And obviously, like e-commerce is such a big part of retail now that it is, it does need to be a focus for many brands., and for many it's their only channel really., but I think for me, what started to happen was that I started to lose the joy and the fulfillment and the meaning of it because it's very transactional, right? Like it becomes about selling product for the sake of selling product. And then it's like, yeah, we're doing this give back and we're donating a portion of sales to this. But then it's like, I'm just writing a check. That's what, you know, I was.
Julie Ellis (00:23:05) - Like, I didn't feel like that's connection and engagement that you wanted to have with it.
Alyssa Kerbel (00:23:09) - No, no, it just for me personally, that just felt like it just started to feel more like, empty and it didn't matter the numbers.
Alyssa Kerbel (00:23:23) - I think this is like something that's interesting. Like if you start to like, have success in your hitting numbers and it's like exciting, but you're you're kind of like, oh, that's great, you know, on to the next, you know, like whatever. It's just like, what is it for? And I think maybe that sort of leads into the, this piece of around goals and what we're striving for and what we're looking to achieve and why what what is the importance of it. Or, you know, because I think my own experience was like, I built, I was building and I was growing and I was like, we were hitting certain like, you know, milestones along the way. But it didn't necessarily feel the way I thought it was going to feel. And that made me start to sort of question like, okay, but like, what is why am I doing this? Like if it's not feeling fulfilling and meaningful and exciting, or if I'm not feeling like I'm having impact with it, I think that's the big thing for me is like, what is the impact? And there was always the impact of like the fact that we make amazing product and we do it in an ethical, sustainable way.
Alyssa Kerbel (00:24:33) - And that's what we want people to be purchasing. And we want, like, there was always a million good things. But no.
Julie Ellis (00:24:39) - But it doesn't mean that over time you don't have a place where you can see that the kind of impact you want to make is changing. And so you've got to sort of change the container that you're doing it within.
Alyssa Kerbel (00:24:51) - Yes. And I think, I mean, you're wearing a Kind Human Club sweatshirt today.
Julie Ellis (00:24:56) - I'm wearing a Kind Human Club sweatshirt!
Alyssa Kerbel (00:24:57) - And and that was, you know, that's a bit of a story as to how that came about. But we, I launched this thing called Kind Human Club while I still had mini mioche. And I think for me, my actual like, I've always been in fashion, I've always loved clothes. And that was always like growing up. And, you know, even when I was going, like, it was always kind of like, oh, Alyssa, you should be in fashion because that's the one thing you like. You love to shop.
Alyssa Kerbel (00:25:22) - You love to like, help people shop. Like basically it was kind of like, that's the only thing you're good at. So you better figure out how you can incorporate that into a job. And in the end, I did like I ended up in fashion sales kind of by not intentionally, but that's where I ended up., and I do love fashion. I do love clothes. But actually, I think what I am most passionate about is people, right? Like, I love people and I like and growth and and personal development and and like, how do we feel good and how do we live better and how do we feel more connected and how do we raise kind conscience. And so I started to like, feel like I want to be playing more in that space. And I think, yeah.
Julie Ellis (00:26:06) - And it feels it feels like the through line for you is really like helping people. So with your agency, you were helping people find great clothes with mini mioche, were helping moms find clothes that were sustainable and comfortable and fashionable.
Julie Ellis (00:26:21) - And, you know, then with Kind Human Club, you were helping, you know, real people who are in bad circumstances in their lives who needed support as their kids were sick. Right. And so you just think about like the different and it's if you kind of feels like the through line is, is that helping kind of, you know, in a way that has impact?
Alyssa Kerbel (00:26:42) - Yes. I mean, and I that is what like lights me up. And so I think that when I was running the business and I was on the hamster wheel of the business, I got, I didn't feel like I was helping any. I just lost that feeling for myself, too. Like I just was like, you're not helping yourself. You're not having like. It's like I just started to, like, not feel aligned to this in the same way anymore. And I was like, I don't know if this is still the path for me. And I started to like what I started to do was I actually started to try and, like, morph the business into something else that would be more aligned with me. Alyssa, the founder, and but maybe not serve the business, maybe not serve mini mioche, maybe not serve the customer who loves that brand because they just want to buy the amazing basics that mini mioche offers. Like they just want that beautiful product and like they aren't necessarily where I'm at, like in my journey. And so, you know, that was the struggle for the past couple of years as I was trying to decide what to do with this.
Julie Ellis (00:27:51) - And so then it's this deciding, right? We talked about this before, like the decision between, like, what do we really want in and in your heart of hearts? What did you really want? Versus you know, what you think you should do around building minimization, you know, world domination and all those good things for that business?
Alyssa Kerbel (00:28:10) - Yeah, I think that like, as you know, the the truth is that I think as the business grew and became more. Complex and more people and all of those things. I realized that like, this was not what I love. Like, I don't actually love running a company of this nature like certain people like I think, quite honestly, I've given this thought, you know, retro, retro in retrospect, like, I think, you know, for me, I could have maybe my path would have been different on some level with mini mioche if I had like hired or or had a person early on that was literally like ops, like, you know, that basically. Yeah.
Julie Ellis (00:29:00) - Like a strong second in command, like an integrator.
Alyssa Kerbel (00:29:02) - Right. But like early where it was just like, okay, Alyssa, all you have to do is like, you get creative. You, you do these five things and then we'll deal with like finance and HR and legal and ops and logistics and all of those things that like suck the absolute energy out of me. They are not my thing. And. Right.
Julie Ellis (00:29:25) - And so how long can you do them for before you hit the wall of exhaustion?
Alyssa Kerbel (00:29:29) - And I think that like for a, I think maybe if you have that early on it's a little bit different.
Alyssa Kerbel (00:29:35) - I think like or I think for me too, I struggled to let go. I had a lot of fear around like, oh, can I trust people to do this? I had a few missteps where I did trust people and it didn't go so well and things along the way. I did have an amazing second in command over the last number of years. Who was doing all of that for me? And, you know, and that made it a thousand times better. And that made me realize like, oh my God, like, you know, but I think at that point, I'd already started to feel this misalignment with the whole thing, and it didn't make it like I just wasn't in it in the same way my heart wasn't in it. And I think also like, you know, things have their their journey in our lives. I think, like I started this business when I had a newborn, like I was in this world, like I was in the same demographic that my customer was in.
Alyssa Kerbel (00:30:34) - I cared about, like a lot of the same things I could easily market to them, and like, now it's like I'm not in that world and I don't really feel like, oh, I want to be thinking about like, TikToks for young moms and like, all the like, it's like, this is the world we're in now, where it's like, you're hitting with the message and the like these things and the and it's like, I'm just like, actually not the space that I really want to play in anymore, you know? And it felt like heavy. So I think it was just listening to that. Right. Like, we just don't want to hear our own message a lot of the time. Like that truth that, you know, we avoid because it's like, what does that mean? You know, what does that mean if I don't want that anymore, what was my life going to look like? Who even am I without this thing? Right? Like it becomes such a part of your identity.
Alyssa Kerbel (00:31:31) - It becomes who you are in the world and your value in the world. And it's, like, hard to even fathom. You know what? What your life could look like or who you would be in your life. If you are not the founder or CEO or president of this thing. And that is scary. You know, that is really, I think, requires a lot of unpacking. And we've had this conversation before in terms of like, I did a lot of unpacking over the course of the process, and, and that allowed me to kind of move through it and grieve and allow myself to feel all the things that are there. When you are making a decision like this, because I think it is not like a for most of us, like a, oh, I'm just going to do this and it's done. And it's like, if you if you think that's what it is, you will you do get rocked because you know, it is. It is a deep unpacking of everything this means in your life and what it means going forward and and being able to process all of that,, doing a lot of personal work around that is very helpful.
Alyssa Kerbel (00:32:41) - And, you know, there's people who who grow, start businesses and grow and scale with the full intention of exiting, and there's really no attachment. And it's like, okay, on to the next. Like that was always the intention. That was like, not my M.O., right? So it's different. Everybody's coming from a different place. But if you have put your blood, sweat and tears into something for an extended period of time, you have sacrificed, you have built something of significance. You know, it is it is a very challenging and quite a process to get to a place of being able to let go, I will say. From my own experience.
Julie Ellis (00:33:21) - And so when you got to that place and eventually sold the business, what has it been like coming out on the other side?
Alyssa Kerbel (00:33:29) - I will say it's it's mixed. I was very, very ready and there's no questioning on my part, and I also like, really had a fairly full exit. So, I still own a small piece of the business, but I'm not active in the business.
Alyssa Kerbel (00:33:49) - And the new owner and founder was good with that, and that was really what I wanted too; I didn't, I was very clear that I wanted my freedom. I didn't want an earn out. I didn't want to be an employee of the company for an extended period of time. I was happy to help transition. I was happy to support. I was happy to consult if they needed to. Ongoing, you know, we worked out something, but really they didn't require me a lot. And so I really was sort of like moved out and I moved on instantaneously. That was partially also because I had stuff going on with, you know, family stuff that I was dealing with that was very challenging at the same time that I kind of had to put myself into supporting my, my, my parents. And there was health issues going on there. So like, honestly, like the timing was crazy, but it also was just this gift because it was like all this was going on. I could not have kept going.
Alyssa Kerbel (00:34:47) - I honestly don't know how I could have kept running the company while dealing with everything that was going on. So it was almost like, I like the universe saying, like, you don't have any choice but to leave this thing and focus on your family and focus on what's right in front of you. And because that was what unfolded, it was like I didn't really have time to kind of process in a way that I would have maybe processed things had I had more time and space, but I don't. It is what it is, and now now, you know, it's funny because I kind of thought that I would have some breathing room and I'd have some time to just chill for a bit. But I think ultimately I've had this desire to create and build something new for a while. And, you know, I am now sort of have a bit of a sense of urgency on that path because I have physical space that I've taken on. I have expenses that I have now that are requiring me to act and move with more intention and more, you know, on a quicker pace than I would have probably done otherwise. I will tell you, Julie, I'm like, oh my God. Yes. I like have no choice now, but to get up and go and, and and the truth is I'm still figuring up out like what it is that I'm exactly meant to do. I didn't have a clear plan., but, you know, things just happened, and then you just have to go with it.
Julie Ellis (00:36:24) - Good. And so the space that you're in is the space that you've taken. And what are you up to?
Alyssa Kerbel (00:36:31) - Yeah. So this is I'm in one of the spaces right now. So, when I sold mini mioche, I did keep the Kind Human Club IP, so I wasn't sure if I was going to do anything with that or not. I kind of was just like, I want to keep it and just park it, but when we had, when I had sold mini mioche, we had taken on this space near in downtown Toronto, the west end of downtown Toronto, to kind of use as a showroom and an event space in a community gathering space for the brand, because we had closed our Queen Street location.
Alyssa Kerbel (00:37:04) - And I just wanted somewhere that, like, I couldn't imagine having the brand. And at that point I had not made the decision to sell when this was all happening. But I was like, I can't imagine having this brand and not having somewhere to bring people together to not have any human connection like that, just. That can't happen. So I took this space on and when I sold the business, I kept Kind Human Club. And I also negotiated to keep this space. And then within a couple of months of that, the space above it also became available. And so, I am still in the process of determining exactly how these spaces will be used. They are already being used for a lot of different amazing things. So part of it is a desire that I have to I have a desire to build community and bring people together. I want to foster more human connection. I feel like that is the medicine that we all need right now. Get off zoom, get into a physical space, be around other humans, support each other, and to do it in these these beautiful spaces that also can allow people to come in and offer different classes and different modalities for people to learn, grow, be human together.
Alyssa Kerbel (00:38:19) - So I've, you know, you know me over the course of my journey, I have gotten into a lot of different things, from meditation to breathwork to cold plunging and, you know, sauna and, movement and dance and somatic work and plant medicine and psychedelics and all of those things have honestly helped me through my journey immensely. I believe so fully in and you don't have to do all of these practices, but all of these practices, I believe, can be very supportive to us, especially in this world that we're living in, where we are just kind of in fight or flight all the time. To certain degree. We're always going. We don't stop or plugged in. Our nervous systems are frazzled. We just need to slow things down. We need to be in community. We need to be supporting each other through difficult things. So that's what's been happening in the spaces currently is there's been a lot of different sort of workshops and breathwork and visioning stuff, and there's a men's circle happening tomorrow night and women's circles and just like Beautiful Things, which I love, I love that I love holding space, and I love being able to bring amazing teachers and guides and facilitators together to give them a space to do their beautiful work, and to introduce it to people.
Alyssa Kerbel (00:39:38) - I think that will be a continued part of what these spaces are. And then, I think the other part of it that I'm just sort of like working through now is the idea around supporting. The other piece for me is around supporting female founders and supporting entrepreneurs. They always say that you're best equipped to help the person you once were. So like, I've been on this journey for 20 years, I have, you know, gone through the kids and gone through all the things and gone through two exits and gone through all this stuff. And I know how the only thing that's really helped me navigate it effectively is being surrounded by people who get it. And the people who get it the most are other women entrepreneurs who are navigating something similar, and so, you know, there are obviously communities already that exist for female founders and entrepreneurs and they're all amazing. I think what I'm looking to create is something that is not just around how are you building your business, but it's like, how are you feeling while doing this? What is actually serving you? Incorporating the wellness practices, incorporating growth and personal development and the work, and also what is going to support you in achieving your big goals in and and and going back to the questioning of allowing people the space, the time, the sounding board, the safe container to to open up, to question things, to say or to have people question them.
Alyssa Kerbel (00:41:11) - You know, I think doing that in community can be very effective. And we've been in a mastermind group together for a number of years back in the day where it was like, that's the role we served for each other. In some ways, it's like this, you know, to question, to say, is this really what you want? Is this really what's working for you? Like, you know, we can go after. Big goals like we can set really big goals for ourselves. And I think that's amazing. I think it's amazing to be like striving for something that is going to push you out of your comfort zone, that is going to challenge you. That is where growth happens. That's where expansion happens. And that's what life is about to me is growth, expansion, all of those things., and it also, if we're not careful, can cause us to burn out, to suffer from extreme stress and anxiety. It can cause all these other things if we're not careful.
Julie Ellis (00:42:02) - The thing about big goals is they aren't just about climbing the mountain for your business, right? They need to be holistic and contain, you know, the different components so that, you know, we all end up in the right place in terms of, yeah, if you end up at achieving every business goal you want and you're burnt out and good for nothing, then it doesn't it, that's not success.
Alyssa Kerbel (00:42:26) - And I think it's just a matter of, like, digging a little deep to ask ourselves, why is this important to me? What is the impact that I'm looking to make? And, you know, sometimes, like, for example, you know, I was on a mission to grow my image. And, you know, I, for example, decided to open a store in Los Angeles. I think that wasn't really a goal necessarily of mine, but it was a goal to grow the business and it and an opportunity came along to open a store in a place where I felt like it was going to really support our US business. It was going to give us a lot of brand exposure.
Alyssa Kerbel (00:43:04) - It was going to do all these things. So my goal was to grow the business, and I made opening a store in Los Angeles the the way to get to that goal or to write.
Julie Ellis (00:43:14) - You took the opportunity that came to move towards.
Alyssa Kerbel (00:43:18) - And I think in hindsight, if I could look back and coach myself a little bit through that, I would say, okay, why do you really want to grow the US business? Why is that important to you? Is this the best way to do this? How is this? If you have this as your goal, how is opening a store in LA going to affect your life? Is this going to be conducive to your life right now with having young kids and having all these other things going on? What's going to how much is it going to give versus how much? It's like sometimes times we just need to question those goals a little bit. To just drill down to, is this goal in service of me, in service of my life and in service of my business? Or is it not because I think that's where, you know, I think for me, with the feminine side of things, it's around like the more we're able to like, nurture ourselves, our well-being, the people around us show up for ourselves, prioritize that the better things tend to go.
Alyssa Kerbel (00:44:17) - And sometimes the goals we set for ourselves are at odds with that.
Julie Ellis (00:44:21) - Yeah, yeah. And I think it's sort of that it's learning to listen both to our own selves internally and to learn to trust the messages that are there. But it's also finding a way to listen to, yeah, the advice that you get to filter it and not just, you know, say, no, I'm doing this, I'm going, this is where it is. Right? And sort of taking off the, you know, the the shields that keep you looking, you know, into narrow of a place for sure.
Alyssa Kerbel (00:44:51) - I think that like, you know, we've been conditioned to a certain extent for sure that when we're entrepreneurs that success is about growth, it's about scale, it's about the numbers, it's about the metrics. It's about the lists that we're on. It's we're like constantly, I think on some level, seeking external validation for what we're doing because, you know, it's like I'm successful. Like, look, I did it.
Alyssa Kerbel (00:45:16) - I made the list, whatever. And it's like, I feel like, you know, success going back to like defining success. It's like, you don't have to be you can you don't have to be on a list to be successful. Like, you can have an amazing business and an amazing life. And you could have maybe like some financial freedom. And it doesn't have to be the biggest thing ever, right.
Julie Ellis (00:45:36) - Like but yeah. And then there's also a case to be made for people who do want it to be the biggest thing ever and who see all of those steps of getting on the lists and having it on the right people. And like all of the things as just part of the strategy that goes along with climbing that hill. Right? So it's like how and I think this is really back to like the deciding what we really want versus what we think we should do. Right. And so it's that piece of, you know, it's not always right for everyone.
Alyssa Kerbel (00:46:07) - No. And I mean, if you're if you're on that mission and you're wanting to grow and you're wanting to hit those bigger goals, I think a huge part of it is, yeah, like getting the right support, you know, surrounding yourself with the right people, the right, you know, team and also the right community, the right like peers, the other people who are on a similar journey who can like, you know, they say you're obviously like the, you know, whatever the top five people you spend your most time with or whatever is a reflection of whatever.
Alyssa Kerbel (00:46:39) - But it's like if you want to be on that growth path, then yes, spend time with people who are doing that and are aligned to that, you know?
Julie Ellis (00:46:48) - Yeah. Good. Well, thank you so much for joining me today. It was a really great conversation and I'm wishing you all the best with the spaces that you have now and the new things that you're up to. And I can't wait to see you where you go.
Alyssa Kerbel (00:47:02) - Thank you. Thanks for having me. It was an honor and a true pleasure to talk to you. Also, I always enjoy.
Julie Ellis (00:47:11) - I hope you enjoyed today's episode. Please remember to hit subscribe on your favourite podcast platform. So you won't miss any episodes. Figure Eight isn't just a podcast, it's a way of seeing the big, gorgeous goals of women entrepreneurs coming to life. If you're interested in learning more, you can find my book, Big Gorgeous Goals on Amazon anywhere you might live. For more about my growth and leadership training programs, visit www.julieellis.ca to see how we might work together.
Julie Ellis (00:47:47) - Read my blog or sign up to get your free diagnostic. Are you ready for growth? Once again. That's julieellis.ca. When we work together, we all win. See you again soon for another episode of Figure Eight.